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CAFCASS - Court Ordered
#31
Very difficult one having a caffcass report not supporting you. I think maybe to get any success you are going to need a solicitor to fight your corner. I would at this stage be trying to get supervised contact and offer to do a SPIP course . another thing you may need to look at is why they are only offering indirect contact and how to change that. one of moderators might be on here later to advise further. also like suggested above do one of the courses above as on day need to convince judge not to follow caffcass recommendation
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#32
Writing to CAFCASS at this point isn't going to help.

A SPIP course is for the benefit of the parents. Your son needs to convince the judge (not CAFCASS) that he needs to stay in the life of his child and that doing so is in the best interests of the child. CAFCASS's plan is rubbish as it is essentially saying that your son has no capacity for change and that there is nothing that can be done to improve the situation.

A Contact Centre Intervention is a solution. He re-establishes contact in a supervised setting and from there he can do contact in a supervised setting..... for a while.

Dont be downhearted. All is not lost.
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#33
(09-10-2018, 05:31 PM)Chi21965 Wrote: Writing to CAFCASS at this point isn't going to help.

A SPIP course is for the benefit of the parents. Your son needs to convince the judge (not CAFCASS) that he needs to stay in the life of his child and that doing so is in the best interests of the child. CAFCASS's plan is rubbish as it is essentially saying that your son has no capacity for change and that there is nothing that can be done to improve the situation.

A Contact Centre Intervention is a solution. He re-establishes contact in a supervised setting and from there he can do contact in a supervised setting..... for a while.

Dont be downhearted. All is not lost.

In the report CAFCASS have said:

Regarding contact centre is says:

This would certainly ensure that the child was physically safe, but it is not viable long term solution and unless there is a clear exit plan it would not be in the the childs best interests to start contact that would then potentially have to stop.

I really don't understand this statement.  What are your thoughts?

TBH the Judge really was not on my son's side at court last time, and i believe he will go with the CAFCASS recommendations.   Which is "Indirect Contract" with the chance to apply to court again after 1 year.   WE have sent cards, gifts etc, and have never had any reply or thank you.   I know my grandchild is being told the gifts are from his mum (not us).

Also CAFCASS visited my grandson at his home with his mother present.  This is part of the report:

Grandson ** completed the three houses worksheet on my computer. Grandson * was able to move figures and place who he wanted to have in certain houses. Grandson* placed himself, his baby sister, Mummy and (step-father) and a friend in the ‘happy house’. In the ‘safe house’ he placed his maternal grandparents and added some figures to keep them company. Grandson ** placed figures in the ‘sad house’ but they were not named, and he only did that so that the house would not be empty. Grandson**  did not mention his father or paternal grandparents and given the uncertainty of these proceedings I did not ask him a direct question.

I found this really hard to understand, CAFCASS state "grandson did not mention us, so she did not ask him a direct question".  He is only 5 years old and have had no contact with his dad or us for over a year... so he would not mention us unless you asked him about us... Why would he, he doesn't know it's a test..  I am completely flabbergasted by this..... is this RIGHT, it sounds so wrong.
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#34
The judge is not going to be on your side when there is the potential that harm could come to the child and this is the picture that CAFCASS wants to paint and that you have to resist.

The contact center questiin you have is more simple than you think. CAFCASS is saying a contact centre would work but unless there is a plan for what happens at the end of those sessions then contact would have to stop again because the safety of the child could not be guaranteed. You need to press for the idea of a CAFCASS programme to re-start contact and that is a Contact Centre Intervention. CAFCASS pay for it. The exit plan (what happens after the programme) is that you say you will have supervised contact for x months and possibly re-assess. Basically CAFCASS aren't doing their jobs and you need to do it for them. You can be as polite as you want to be but now the convincing you need to do is with the judge. If the findings of DV have been upheld against your son, I suggest he puts himself forward for a DV course at the next hearing. He may want to think about that. He should sign up for the course I gave the link for in a previous message. It's free and he can get the book out of the library.

And yes, CAFCASS should not have inteeviewed your son in the presence of his mother. Its a typical CAFCASS way of behaving. How does CAFCASS'S think a child is going to think positively about their father and his parents when he doesn't see them, is interviewed in the presence of his mother and is not given thr chance to be observed with his father.
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#35
(09-11-2018, 11:35 AM)Chi21965 Wrote: The judge is not going to be on your side when there is the potential that harm could come to the child and this is the picture that CAFCASS wants to paint and that you have to resist.

The contact center questiin you have is more simple than you think. CAFCASS is saying a contact centre would work but unless there is a plan for what happens at the end of those sessions then contact would have to stop again because the safety of the child could not be guaranteed. You need to press for the idea of a CAFCASS programme to re-start contact and that is a Contact Centre Intervention. CAFCASS pay for it. The exit plan (what happens after the programme) is that you say you will have supervised contact for x months and possibly re-assess. Basically CAFCASS aren't doing their jobs and you need to do it for them. You can be as polite as you want to be but now the convincing you need to do is with the judge. If the findings of DV have been upheld against your son, I suggest he puts himself forward for a DV course at the next hearing. He may want to think about that. He should sign up for the course I gave the link for in a previous message. It's free and he can get the book out of the library.

And yes, CAFCASS should not have inteeviewed your son in the presence of his mother. Its a typical CAFCASS way of behaving. How does CAFCASS'S think a child is going to think positively about their father and his parents when he doesn't see them, is interviewed in the presence of his mother and is not given thr chance to be observed with his father.

Thank yoiu - that makes more sense now (contact centre).   I did not know their was such a programme as the Contact Centre Intervention, as this has never been mentioned by anyone.  Just so I am getting this right,  the Contact Centre Intervention is a programme that leads to supervised contact in a contact centre, then next step unsupervised contact etc etc.

I have signed my son up to the course you suggested.  He is away for 10 days and will get him started as soon as he returns.

I agree he needs admit defeat and ask for DV course - at present he is saying NO WAY I DID NOT DO ANYTHING..  but as you say he needs to look at the bigger picture.   Just need to convince him it is not admitting he is guilty it is a step in the right direction (towards his son).  

The biggest problem I have, is that I can give him wise words and help, but once he steps in the court house, he is on his own and I am sure it all goes out the window.  I did put post it notes with bullet points in his folder and have written down and printed off his points/what he wants/questions - again I am not sure he reads them when he is in court.

i can only help so much... then he is on his own ...
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#36
he needs to remain calm in court , dont interrupt, offer to do courses . anything within reason to see son. if he is asked to do a DV course and he refuses your son walks away with no contact at all. by doing these courses voluntarily as well its showing the judge what he would like to see cause at moment hes staring at a caffcass report that isnt very good at all
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#37
Hi Nanny. The course is entirely by email, so (although I do not know what he is doing whilst he is away) it may be something he is able to do (a bit per week) whilst he is away.

The Contact Centre Intervention (CCI) is a programme for the participation on both parents and the child. It is paid for by CAFCASS and starts at 12 hours. It works like this, they do an hour or two of preparing the child for contact, a hour each (done separately) of preparing the parents for contact and a couple of (supervised) contact sessions. If appropriate they can do some work with the parents together to sort out their differences and lastly a 'next steps meeting' to discuss what happens next.

The CCI does not necessarily have to lead to supervised contact. It can lead to unsupervised but I guess the court would like to to be cautious and I think that is what your son should suggest, participation in the CCI programme followed by a schedule of supervised contact. In terms of the DV course, I think your son should say he is wiling to attend to allay any fears his ex might have but that that is not an admission of guilt. You have not heard of the CCI because CAFCASS have jot done their job, it's that simple. If they are saying that there is risk of harm, they should have come up with a plan of how that harm could be mollified.

Your son going to court and relying in your notes won't help him. He needs a strategy and a plan before he walk in and he needs to make his plan known to the judge before they even get in the Hearing room. That is done by writing a Note for thr judge on the day (you provide a copy for the other side via the clerk on the day) and that way the judge reads it and knows what your son has done to make things better, what he is suggesting to improve things and make himself an even better dad. If your son is not the kind to speak up, he really (really) needs to win before even setting foot inside court.

******

I've been searching for the CAFCASS link on CCIs and just like CAFCASS, they make almost everything they do and everything they are about impossible to find. They have a two page leaflet which you can download. You will find it here:

https://www.cafcass.gov.uk/grown-ups/par...ts-carers/

The fifth item down on the left hand side of the page is called 'child contact', click on that and when it expands, click on "Child Contact Intervention". CAFCASS have obviously renamed it in the last couple of months. Once you click and download it, you'll get a two page leaflet which explains what a CCI/Child Contact Intervention is all about.
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#38
(09-11-2018, 01:08 PM)Chi21965 Wrote: Hi Nanny. The course is entirely by email, so (although I do not know what he is doing whilst he is away) it may be something he is able to do (a bit per week) whilst he is away.

The Contact Centre Intervention (CCI) is a programme for the participation on both parents and the child. It is paid for by CAFCASS and starts at 12 hours. It works like this, they do an hour or two of preparing the child for contact, a hour each (done separately) of preparing the parents for contact and a couple of (supervised) contact sessions. If appropriate they can do some work with the parents together to sort out their differences and lastly a 'next steps meeting' to discuss what happens next.

The CCI does not necessarily have to lead to supervised contact. It can lead to unsupervised but I guess the court would like to to be cautious and I think that is what your son should suggest, participation in the CCI programme followed by a schedule of supervised contact. In terms of the DV course, I think your son should say he is wiling to attend to allay any fears his ex might have but that that is not an admission of guilt. You have not heard of the CCI because CAFCASS have jot done their job, it's that simple. If they are saying that there is risk of harm, they should have come up with a plan of how that harm could be mollified.

Your son going to court and relying in your notes won't help him. He needs a strategy and a plan before he walk in and he needs to make his plan known to the judge before they even get in the Hearing room. That is done by writing a Note for thr judge on the day (you provide a copy for the other side via the clerk on the day) and that way the judge reads it and knows what your son has done to make things better, what he is suggesting to improve things and make himself an even better dad. If your son is not the kind to speak up, he really (really) needs to win before even setting foot inside court.

******

I've been searching for the CAFCASS link on CCIs and just like CAFCASS, they make almost everything they do and everything they are about impossible to find. They have a two page leaflet which you can download. You will find it here:

https://www.cafcass.gov.uk/grown-ups/par...ts-carers/

The fifth item down on the left hand side of the page is called 'child contact', click on that and when it expands, click on "Child Contact Intervention". CAFCASS have obviously renamed it in the last couple of months. Once you click and download it, you'll get a two page leaflet which explains what a CCI/Child Contact Intervention is all about.

Thank you for all your help.

There seems to be a problem with the Netmum course - as he has not received any emails from them to start the course.  he is on holiday at the moment.

I have emailed our nearest DAPP contact and await their reply about courses in our area.  to see if my son can attend a course ASAP.  

Should my son write to CAFCASS asking about the CCI or wait until his court date?

CAFCASS have said in the Section 7 they have considered a referral to building better relationships. Unfortunately given (my son) denial of any of the findings he is not suitable for such a course.  As such I would suggest that (my son) identify courses that he considers suitable and if after a year he feels that he has made sufficient progress he could make a further application for direct contact.  A futher Section 7 would need to be conpleted at that point.

With regards to the note to the judge, can you give me pointers as what he should write?  Sorry if this is not appropriate, i completely understand.

Thank you so much for all your help -  I would be completely lost with you and this site.
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#39
The Netmums course has that issue, it's not a problem. He needs to keep checking his emails and to check his junk emails. Once he has an email he needs to add the address to his 'safe' contacts so that he gets them all. It took a week or two before I got my first email.

I think your son needs to keep the CCI under his hat until the court date. If it comes from him together with his having completed/participated in the Family Links/Netmums course and seeking out a domestic violence course, the judge should be impressed with his get up and go and his willingness to work towards a resolution.

Sorry, but I think a year is too long. I think your son needs to get back (fully) in his sons life ASAP. When is the next court date? I'll come back to you about the Note a bit later on.
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#40
2 nd October
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