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Brainwashing children
#1
Hi everyone,

I have successfully obtained an approved and stamped child arrangements order by consent. I have the children 3 nights a week. But ex is now using different tactics. She is coaching my 10 year old daughter and brainwashing to say she is not comfortable at my house and that she does not want to stay at mine. I know it is not my daughter saying it and that she has been coached by the bitter ex.

My question is how can I stop her from doing this? Is there anything I can do? The last thing I want is for my children to say that they don't want to come over. Every time my daughter says it my heart breaks.

Can I get social services involved or something?

All help much appreciated
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#2
hi sandman its somthing in having to deal with right now, and my daughters only 3 years old, i totally agree with you its heart breaking, and like you i dont no how to deal with it,
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#3
Maybe it’s the time of year but I’m also going through this. I’ve been wondering if I should talk to social services but then I’ve heard such horrendous stories about them I wonder if it’s the right thing. I do feel the ex needs a shot across the bow to make her wind her neck in.
I’d be interested to know if anyone has tackled this?
I can’t help feel it’s another year of court and cafcass, asking for the ex to be assessed etc. Maybe a Solicitor’s letter?
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#4
The best way is to calmly speak to your daughter about it and find out why she says the way she feels. If your ex is alienating her then you should just morally correct her wrongdoings. Social services wont do nothing and a solicitors letter will end up costing you money and being ignored by ex partner. Also if you show it isnt affecting you she might stop been silly and put your daughter 1st and encourage contact
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#5
ask your child has anyone said this to you.

and then tell them to ignore it,.
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#6
I think I would report it again and again and again until it lasts. Even though social services are stupid and the kind of women who work there oh my God probably themselves coming from dysfunctional homes. I had a chance to speak to them and see in person once. Damaged women tramps, riff raffs ( London anyway) I was told once that before I call or come again I need to think twice because mother has the upper hand and she can stop contact so I should be careful, I got impression that they were actually amused by the situation especially when they said about the upper hand business. I would still report it I would mention incase they didn't know ( I'm sure they don't) it's a child abuse and if they won't sort this out u re going to take matters in ur hands. Maybe after one call from them ex ll get bit scared and stop this nonsense.

First I would speak to ex very firmly no joking. It's a child abuse and if doesn't stop u ll report it to socials u promise her that u ll not leave this alone and just see what happens if continues simply report it. One day u might go court u ll have evidence u tried the worst thing u can do is do nothing.

Most of those parasites ( mothers) don't want socials on their neck no matter how minor or silly stuff they just don't want to deal with them incase they find out something else, so probably she ll give up on alienation unless she proper mental or twisted even that I think she will stop.
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#7
Its not easy, daughter clams up when asked about these things. When she was younger we would play dinosaur tea party and the dinosaurs would chat about things.
This seemed to give her the freedom to express herself because it wasnt her it was the dinosaur talking.
However I can tell instantly when somethings wrong because she goes quiet, I can see her thinking about what she is supposed to say. It cant be pushed because she then just goes quiet. It was actually the school who raised the concern with me about it, but I dont know what to do about it.
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#8
(01-10-2019, 06:20 PM)Robert London Wrote: Damaged women tramps

Quick reminder that comments like this are not permitted on the forum. We've all be burned in someway, often by women. But its not all women, just some people.
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#9
(01-10-2019, 11:58 AM)sandman Wrote: Hi everyone,

I have successfully obtained an approved and stamped child arrangements order by consent. I have the children 3 nights a week. But ex is now using different tactics. She is coaching my 10 year old daughter and brainwashing to say she is not comfortable at my house and that she does not want to stay at mine. I know it is not my daughter saying it and that she has been coached by the bitter ex.

My question is how can I stop her from doing this? Is there anything I can do? The last thing I want is for my children to say that they don't want to come over. Every time my daughter says it my heart breaks.

Can I get social services involved or something?

All help much appreciated

I have also had this experience and can offer what helped. It is a massive thing and very hard to get dealt with. The most important things are - your order, and learning some stuff about parental alienation to help you counteract it.

This book was my bible for a while and it helped massively. Doesn't stop the ex doing it but helps stop the child being damaged and gives you some control. My son was being heavily alienated two years ago to the point where he actually was like an alien. You need to nip it in the bud before they try and reject you completely. Understanding what is going on for the kids is half the battle to knowing how to deal with it. For now, at least, normal parenting goes out the window - you can't do normal stuff like tell them off or question them about stuff - it has to be very low key. The kids are under so much pressure that their reaction eventually is to try and push you to reject them - once you get angry - that gives them the reason to reject you and align themselves with the other parent. This is not deliberate but they cannot cope pscyhologically and the relief from the alienating tactics is when they align themselves with the alienating parent.

Karen Woodall has a blog on parental alienation - some is good and helpful. But this book is a handbook - also written by a parental alienation specialist in the US (Amy J Baker) and easy to read or just dip into chapters. When I read it, it was mind blowing and my situation was textbook.

Karen and Nick Woodall also wrote a book on parental alienation. In it they say the first step is a clearly defined court order - which you have I guess.

How often do you see them? And is the ex keeping to the order? The theory being - the more you show them normality and a happy home, the more the alienation wears off - and it also gives them a break from the horrendous mind messing they are getting at the ex's. Hence parenting being different. Don't get into dialogue or fall into the "message passing" thing. Son used to pass on a nasty message the minute I collected him, which was usually a bombshell and caused stress to the point his time here was spoiled (the intention) and also made son unable to see normality here - just stress. So the technique was listen - don't say anything - change the subject, be calm ALWAYS. Don't answer questions - change the subject. But you have to use some judgement with that. If they say - Mum says you killed someone and went to prison, is that true? Then correct it but don't say anything negative about the Mother at all. So you say - no that isn't true, your Mum is mistaken. Distract - do normal nice things. The worst thing I found was the immense stress my son was under. In my case it was going to court that (mostly) stopped it because I highlighted what was going on and had some written evidence that indicated parental alienation.

However Cafcass and social services are not experts in it and get it wrong - which can make things worse. So tread carefully but do keep keeping records, a diary, etc.

It was hard not being able to be myself with my son - because it wasn't possible - because he wasn't himself. And to have to not discipline when normally you would. Correct anything they ask that is untrue but never criticize the ex - slowly you will be seen as the good, reliable, trustworthy parent. The kids will resist - but will feel torn because they have loyalty to both parents. If the pressure gets too much and they can't resist and just say what the Mother wants then as long as they keep coming you can manage it. If they stop coming, enforce immediately and apply for a variation for more time. The argument being to reduce the amount of conflict for the children and having more time with you away from negativity by the ex. Which is why keeping a diary is important - anything unusual they do or say, any bizarre comments or questions they come out with - record it.

Alienation and the court process is a minefiedl - you can't go in and say - they're being alienated - or you can be accused of being the alienator. It takes a bit of gentle hinting and letting someone else decide. And evidence (which is hard to show).

Anyway this is the book - not a great title - but it will help a lot. The other tip I was given by a parenting professional was - show empathy to the child. eg if they are saying outrageous thigns and behaving badly or erratically - dont get angry. Wait for the right moment and say "things must be really hard for you at the moment, are you coping ok?" That shows them you care and understand.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Co-parenting-To...a+toxic+ex

Just wanted to say - my son is past all that - mostly. And back to his old self. The court process helped. It hasn't stopped completely - she still spoils his enjoyment of anything at my home and he is still quite controlled - but he is his normal self again when here and is growing up.

The most important thing is - keep them coming. Once they stop coming the alienation can be completed very quickly - as the ex is the only person they see and they are totally dependant on her then for their day to day survival.
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