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More holiday tinkering
#1
So after the fiasco in January when ex booked a holiday over my defined weeks, and I agreed to change weeks this year.  At the time I asked her if there was any summer school at the new secondary school and when - no reply.  Asked primary school - they said they didn't think so, just transition days in summer term. Since then I've had a pack of info from the secondary school with a lot of dates in about transition days etc.  But no mention of a summer school.  A letter has clearly been sent to her - it isn't dated - she could have had it for ages.  I now have a holiday booked for the first week of the summer holidays.  Just paid final balance two days ago.  She knows this.

Tonight son arrives with this letter sent by his Mum, sent from the secondary school, about the first week of summer holidays being summer school.  On the bottom she has written that son is booked onto this!  The cheek of doing that without even consulting me when he's in my care that week (shared care order).

So she must be laughing her socks off.  And she will make an almighty stink if I say - going on holiday, it's booked - should have told me sooner - because she will insist he has to go because it's an educational thing.  And really he should go.

Feel a bit stuck - I will lose an awful lot of money if I cancel this holiday.  Reacted when I saw the letter and said - argh that is when our holiday is booked.  Son said ok I'll tell Mum.  I said - hang fire I need to think about this.

Just frustrated really as I suspected this is why she wanted to swap summer holiday weeks in the first place and if I had known about the summer school earlier I would have booked later in the summer when he's here.
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#2
She is persisting in making life extremely difficult for you. Your logic is correct that you won't be able to challenge it as she will play the education card.

Is it possible for you to reschedule your travel arrangements to another week when you are due to have him in the summer? It'll cost you but maybe not as much if the whole thing is cancelled.
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#3
Hi. Looked into that - not possible and I lose the whole lot if I cancel. However - have decided - we're going on holiday. It is a voluntary summer school and he has had lots of transition sessions already and made some friends from other schools plus more just before term ends. If she had wanted him to go she should have told me earlier. Maybe she didn't know about it until last week.

I think what she will try and pull is, that because we agreed (in writing) to swap holiday weeks - that the time isn't enforceable because different to what is in the court order. Although it's educational, it is not during term-time.
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#4
(06-06-2019, 07:38 PM)Charlie7000 Wrote: I think what she will try and pull is, that because we agreed (in writing) to swap holiday weeks - that the time isn't enforceable because different to what is in the court order.  Although it's educational, it is not during term-time.

I would be weary as she maybe plotting, as you say, to rely on the original order and not hand your son over to you at the time agreed and thereby, screw up your holiday plans just prior to when you are due to leave.
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#5
Surely you outrank her in that time therefore take your holiday. She can't just book your son onto something without consulting you.
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#6
Exactly - she shouldn't have booked him on without consulting with me. In fact if she had, I may well have cancelled the holiday and lost the deposit but have now paid for it in full. It's usually accepted though that educational things and activities come first - except - there is a holiday booked and that is good for him too.

Leader I am getting a bad feeling about that too. If she just keeps him and prevents him coming, I could maybe apply for a specific issues order for the holiday on the Monday - by the time that gets heard the holiday week would be nearly over. She is then away on holiday for 2 weeks and I can't see the court saying son can't go and miss yet another holiday. So I could go a month without seeing him, during which time she will thoroughly alienate him in time for an enforcement application - as I assume I'd have to submit one of those as well and by the time that is heard the summer holidays would be over.

I think she wants a court application because she wants Cafcass to talk to son - and if she alienates him first .....I am sure she is out to try and make sure he never sees me again before he starts secondary school.

But hey have to keep positive. Am sending an email tomorrow saying unfortunately already have a holiday booked and paid for or it would have been a good thing to do. That I have explained to son it is the same week and so we will be away and he is fine with that.

No doubt she will reply making a real stink insisting on him going because it's educational and saying he doesn't want to come on holiday with me and I should go on my own and leave him with her blah di blah.

Maybe she isn't worried about an enforcement application if it takes 3 weeks to get a hearing and she'll be on holiday then and son will be quite alienated. He is fine tonight but she had been working on him a couple of weeks ago and causing some trust issues. With a month away I don't think he could resist it, if it was full on for a long period.
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#7
(06-06-2019, 03:04 PM)Charlie7000 Wrote: So after the fiasco in January when ex booked a holiday over my defined weeks, and I agreed to change weeks this year.  At the time I asked her if there was any summer school at the new secondary school and when - no reply.  Asked primary school - they said they didn't think so, just transition days in summer term. Since then I've had a pack of info from the secondary school with a lot of dates in about transition days etc.  But no mention of a summer school.  A letter has clearly been sent to her - it isn't dated - she could have had it for ages.  I now have a holiday booked for the first week of the summer holidays.  Just paid final balance two days ago.  She knows this.

Tonight son arrives with this letter sent by his Mum, sent from the secondary school, about the first week of summer holidays being summer school.  On the bottom she has written that son is booked onto this!  The cheek of doing that without even consulting me when he's in my care that week (shared care order).

So she must be laughing her socks off.  And she will make an almighty stink if I say - going on holiday, it's booked - should have told me sooner - because she will insist he has to go because it's an educational thing.  And really he should go.

Feel a bit stuck - I will lose an awful lot of money if I cancel this holiday.  Reacted when I saw the letter and said - argh that is when our holiday is booked.  Son said ok I'll tell Mum.  I said - hang fire I need to think about this.

Just frustrated really as I suspected this is why she wanted to swap summer holiday weeks in the first place and if I had known about the summer school earlier I would have booked later in the summer when he's here.

To give you an idea on timeschale for transition, each Local Authroity has 1 or 2 transistion days.

However, they also have an "Enhanced" transistion program, what is optional. In my sons case, the extra Transition dates and activitys was known in May, but as residance had changed in March and I only got housing in place in April, it was the 3rd tier of school allocations he got accepted in.  It could be that they have dates already in place at 1st stage of allocations.

It might be worth calling the school and explaining the situation. If this is outside normal term time, there is no requirement for the child to attend in law.
Posts made by me are my opinion and any factual information should be checked out. If you do not have a Solicitor, often your local CAB can get you some initial advice.
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#8
Thanks Mark. It is an optional voluntary summer school. It was not mentioned in the school's pack sent out in May - only the transition dates etc were in that. I am just going to reply to her that the holiday is booked and paid for and coincides with that week which I was unaware of as it wasn't mentioned in the school's pack.

There's more - son come out with more messages this morning (cleverly he waits till the morning so it doesn't spoil his night). She is now saying he has to have the school bus to her house every night of the week or she won't get free transport. Court order says I collect him directly to and from school every night. I think she is just trying it on. She is eligible for free transport even if he doesn't use it every day.
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#9
Her response was as predicted. That son could choose (putting him in the middle) which means he will be under a lot of stress and she will say he has chosen to go to the summer school and I should leave him with her if I want to go on my booked holiday.

Have sought legal advice along with all the other issues. All this is because he is going to secondary school in September and she wants to be the sole parent with care at that time - although she does regularly try to disrupt holidays as well.

I need to think carefully though as I suspect she really wants it to go back to court so she can make son say things and try and get sole residency before September. After last application, Cafcass said if it returned to court again they would do a section 7 out of concerns for emotional harm for son caused by conflict between parents. Ex said she would welcome that with open arms, so son could tell them how much he hated coming to my home. And no doubt she would make him make allegations as well.

Am really concerned for him as I think he is at risk of more than emotional harm if she tries to force him to say something untrue.

Anyway maybe a solicitor's letter will knock it on the head. Pointless me responding by email as it won't achieve anything and she will just keep spouting shite and telling me what she will do whether I like it or not.
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#10
(06-07-2019, 03:06 PM)Charlie7000 Wrote: Her response was as predicted.  That son could choose (putting him in the middle) which means he will be under a lot of stress and she will say he has chosen to go to the summer school and I should leave him with her if I want to go on my booked holiday.

Have sought legal advice along with all the other issues.  All this is because he is going to secondary school in September and she wants to be the sole parent with care at that time - although she does regularly try to disrupt holidays as well.

I need to think carefully though as I suspect she really wants it to go back to court so she can make son say things and try and get sole residency before September.  After last application, Cafcass said if it returned to court again they would do a section 7 out of concerns for emotional harm for son caused by conflict between parents.  Ex said she would welcome that with open arms, so son could tell them how much he hated coming to my home.  And no doubt she would make him make allegations as well.

Am really concerned for him as I think he is at risk of more than emotional harm if she tries to force him to say something untrue.

Anyway maybe a solicitor's letter will knock it on the head.  Pointless me responding by email as it won't achieve anything and she will just keep spouting shite and telling me what she will do whether I like it or not.


First off, I feel for you. You come across as really child focussed, putting your son's interests first. Your ex sounds like she's toxic and can poison anything she comes into contact with (put her in contact with my ex please!).

Once you figure out the course of action in reference to this holiday, I would suggest going along with her educational crusade, involving yourself in all the activities she puts on for show - this way it doesn't put your son in the middle (not your fault of course), you come across as a level-headed co-parent, your ex will no longer have power against you.

My ex tries to overload the time that my kids are living with me with extra-curricular activities. I no longer fight it - I just go with it. Should I ever have to go to court if she decides she wants to fack off back to her country with kids, I will have loads of evidence that I am an actively involved father.

Take care Charlie!
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