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Watertight CAO
#11
Yes if it was up to ex then I would never see my children. The issue I have with Judges view is CAFCASS recommended half if holidays but Judge only offering 2 weeks summer holiday no half term, no Easter etc.
Also midweek contact is going to be difficult as children go to bed as early as 7 and it is an hour drive to get there so if I finish work 5 I would have only an hour with them and that isn’t enough. Rather than this I would preferred it to move it to Friday pick up from School with overnight stay and returned them on Saturday.

Moving closer isn’t an option as I have a business locally which cannot move with me.

Finally on her illness I need to put something in the order if she gets ill and spend consider amount of time in hospital then children should live with me rather than grandparents. Previously she spend few months in hospital . I am sure she will hold it from me. She wishes to have to direct communication with me and suggested using an app. She also wants to children ring her on a regular basis using the app when they are in my care.

Also Judge reviewed ex latest medical document and decided that it shouldn’t be disclosed to me.in another way he isn’t concerned about her condition when it comes to caring for children. I might be wrong but I think allowing more time with the mother showing there is more to her condition than we know. I have spoken to few friends who are medical do tans they confirmed the same to me.
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#12
Whatsapp is a good way of communicating or email as no different to app. There is no need for you to let children ring her when they are in your care as u dont have them long enough.
A judge cant give u midweek contact if you are unable to do it . Cant u close early on say a wednesday so u can pick your children up from school and drop them to school in morning . Also if u cant do overnight you could consider closing early just to be able to do school run and then drop them off at mums for 7 ( 4 hours approx contact)
Otherwise u wont get any midweek contact. there is no easter i imagine as overnights not started yet and are only once every weekend for 1st 6 weeks which hasnt started yet.

I dont think judge will put anything in about wifes illness and has concluded she is well enough to care for children. Only phone contact judge will order is in summer holidays and thats it
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#13
I know it’s frustrating having to start slowly like this and possibly having to go back to court again but Judge is looking at it from kids interests to have gradual changes and adjustments. I agree it seems unfair that the business of cultural heritage and your history of care with son has not been taken into consideration. But this is fairly par for the course - you want more - she wants less - you get something in the middle. Longer term what he has ordered is what Cafcass said - eow and one tea time a week. That is a reasonable schedule when you can’t have midweek overnights. If you could move nearer you could have them five nights a fortnight- 3 night week end and a midweek overnight. And to and from school and be more involved in their school
Life.

Court will view it that dual heritage can still be possible within this schedule.

It is unfair that you haven’t seen them for so long when your oldest used to be with you most of the time but they are looking at the adjustment for the kids who, unfortunately, have had a different life without you the last two years.

I would also be disappointed with such a slow progression and only two weeks holidays this year. But - it will become half the holidays. And also things may change. If your ex becomes more sick or even dies. The important thing as Warwickshire says is the fact finding was in your favour - that is fine now - abd there are no welfare issues with you so contact can be more in future if circumstances change.

We all want the kids full time ideally - 50/50 is the fairest- and I do think you will need to go to court again in the future probably to get more time. But I would focus on being able to live closer as that way you can easily see more of your kids. And can apply for the midweek to be an overnight and an extra night at weekends to and from school.
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#14
sb1353 - Judge's comment regardless what has happened in the past in regards your care isn't wholly surprising. Asking for a lot from word go from almost nothing for 2 years is something frowned upon ( from judge's perspective at least). Afraid when we fathers are caught up in a system like this, we need to slowly unpick ourselves from the system. Give yourself and children a few months or year before you go back asking for more, that is what I did. I accepted contact build up for few months, to overnight, to weekends, to holidays, now I'm back at the court asking for 50-50.

I'm sure you were forewarned in the earlier threads about asking for too much too quick.
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#15
He was but partly my fault probably - he had applied for residency and I suggested t trying to go for 50/50. But also ther was a possibility of a consent order and negotiations at one point which could have led to something better.

Situation is a bit unique as well as his ex is too unwell to look after the kids sometimes.
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#16
Thanks guys for your help and support. I do appreciate your input.
Charlie is right my situation is unique and the way the case was handled by family court was poorly. Ex become very ill at the start of proceeding and I decided to withdraw application as I though she was going to die. She had serious health problem and couldn’t look after the children. Her parents doing it for her. After all false allegations and what she put me through I felt sorry for her and put an application in to withdraw my original application. You guys told me ( specially Warwickshire) this is wrong to do so. Ex wanted me to see the Children forever in contact centre even though she was in hospital for months. I decided to proceed with application because it was in best interest on the children. It wasn’t fair on them not to have any parents for months. Because of false allegations I was kept away from them for more than 2 years. From being full time dad I was dad 2 hours a week in a contact centre that everyone looking down on you.

I went through all these and here I am. Ex did again false allegations while I was at contact centre.I guess this is life for our fathers that one had a bitter partner.
After seeing her photos today I felt sorry for ex. My son showed me her picture and she is half size than she was. She had lost all her hair and didn’t look healthy.

Taking everything into account I have no choice to accept as listless as I can get to keep it going . I will have to go back to the court later on, if she becomes very ill then I will have to get the children through the court. The last thing I want to do is to take the children from a dying mother.

I think I’m not sure is about midweek contact. Is this every Wednesday? I can finish early to get the children and take them back to school next day. It takes 50 minutes to do it though.
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#17
It depends what it says in the order. I believe it is usually Wednesdays unless you’ve asked for it to be a different time.

In the event your ex dies then you would automatically be the only parent and with PR. I would think you would automatically have residency but it might mean going to court as the grandparents may well decide to apply for residency as well. But I think you’d have a good chance of residency with a contact order for them. They are not going to want to give up their grandchild.

However your ex may live with cancer for a long time and havd remission. So you can still go back in a year or so.

But I think your best chance is moving nearer to get midweek overnights and a 3 night week end.
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#18
Update
We are due back to court next week. I have now changed my position to the below:
6 weeks every week start immediately
After that move on to full weekend alternate with midweek overnight alternates. The idea is children won’t go without seeing me for 2 weeks and longer they wait is a week.
School holidays to be shared 2 weeks summary and from October onwards 50:50

Ex wants children to spend time with me as little as possible. Here is her proposal

1 overnight for 6 weeks every weekends.
2 over night for alternate weekend for 6 weeks then full alternate weekend after that
No holidays this year.
Midweek tea time contact

I also want to have children with be when she becomes ill i.e go to hospital more than 3 nights. I appreciate that due to distance I can not take them to school and back everyday but I could have them over weekend rather than grandparents.

I need to finalise my position statement by Sunday and would appreciate your help. In my view my proposal is fair but would like to know your view.. thanks
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#19
“ 6 weeks every week start immediately ”

I don’t understand the above bit :-)

Are you proposing every other week end immediately? And one midweek overnight every two weeks? But no tea times.

How about:

1 midweek overnight every week end for first three weeks, increasing to every other week end and one midweek tea time per week until 6 weeks, then every other week end with a tea time one week midweek and an overnight the second week midweek.

Holidays: Four days over Easter, two weeks in summer, five days over Christmas holidays, increasing to half school holidays from 1st Jan defined as

split half terms, a full half of the Easter holidays with consecutive days, a two week and one week defined weeks in summer and a five day and a 3 day period over Christmas with Christmas Eve and Christmas Day on alternate years commencing 2022 and even years with you. (Christmas hols are usually about 16 days so 8 each).

It would help if you could set it out - eg

With Father:

Commencing x date for three weeks

Every Saturday from 9am through to 9am Sunday

Commencing x date for three weeks

Every other week end from school on the Friday through to 6pm Sunday. From school until 6pm each Wednesday.

Commencing x date (is 6 weeks later)

Week 1: from school on Friday to 6pm Sunday and from school on Wednesday until 6pm.

Week 2: from school on Wednesday with return to school on Thursday.

Four days during Easter holidays, two weeks during summer holidays, five days over Christmas holidays.

Commencing 1st January 2022

Term time schedule to remain the same

Half school holidays, with the holidays commencing on the last day of school and ending on the first day back at school, with the exception of the summer holidays, as follows:

Half of each half term with consecutive days and changeover on the Wednesday at mid day, keeping to regular week end schedule throughout the half term holidays.

The first half of the Easter holidays in 2022 and even years and the second half of the Easter holidays in 2023 and odd years.

Weeks 3, 4 and 6 of the summer holidays with holiday weeks commencing 9am the first Monday after term ends.

5pm 23rd December until 11am 26th December and the last five days of the Christmas holidays in 2022 and even years with Father. The remainder of the Christmas holidays with Mother.


5pm 23rd December until 11am 26th December and the last five days of the Christmas holidays in 2023 and odd years with Mother. The remainder of the Christmas holidays with Father.”

The reason for the separate start date for the summer is so the last week end of term is a normal weekend so there aren’t extra days at the end of the summer (as it’s usually a bit longer than 6 weeks). But mainly so everyone knows which week is which so they can plan ahead.

Ultimately the Judge will look at both proposals and either plump for one of them or go somewhere in the middle. I would point out in your position statement that prior to contact being withheld over the past two years while lengthy proceedings have been concluded, that you cared for the children x days a week. You accept that there needs to be a gradual increase of time to allow the children to adjust but that this should be over no longer than a 6 week period as they will adapt quickly due to the historic close relationship in your care, abd are already clingy and reluctant to leave with the current interim schedule. And you feel it is in their best interests to have a regular and significant schedule established as quickly as possible to give them certainty and stability with both parents.

I wouldn’t try for a clause about the Mother being ill just yet. That would be, as someone else said, be looked at as trying to run before you can walk.

Get the order first. With some holidays this year and half the holidays from next year. Then take stock.

But you could add at the end of your wording above

“Such further and other times as agreed between the parties”

Which is fairly standard. Then if in future the Mothdr was in hospital for weeks you could perhaps apply for a specific issues order to say that if the Mother is in hospital the children will be cared for by you. But I would leave that at least a year until you have the full schedule up and running.

And see what happens. Your ex may get better or worse but they will still want to see her.
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#20
We had a hearing yesterday and Judge made a decision so he made it a final hearing without it being a contested one.
We agreed some other things but he made a decision on others.

I compromised a lot during the proceeding saving it for return to court probably next year for more. The arrangement are:
Children to live with mother and spend time with father.
Contact to be every Saturday from 10 am to 5 pm on Sunday for 6 consecutive weeks.
Then it moves on to every other weekend from Friday to Sunday to 5 pm for 6 weeks. And after that from Friday to Monday school pick up and drop off. Ex tried to make it Sunday 6 pm but Judge went with cafcass
Holidays to be shared from October this year with 2 weeks in summer.
No foreign holiday in 2021
I wanted midweek overnight contact but Judge said due to distance and age of my younger son(he is 3 ) itcwould be tiring so will need to go back later on to have more when he goes to school maybe next year. Midweek contact is tea time every other weekend when it isn't my weekend and also a video call for the following so every Wednesday I either see them or have a video call.
Father days always with me and mothers day with ex.
Special day and x mas to alternate
In case she is ill and taken to hospital during term time xhikdren stay with their grandparents but during holiday they will stay with me till their mother is better.
I also asked the court if for whatever reason I.e. cold, flue, temperature etc aren't at school contact should still go ahead. If not contact should be made up later on.
So I think this is it for now. Will need to sort out divorce and finances now and hopefully she will be out of my life for good.
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